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#16 2011-04-19 17:22:16

LittleChickenRacingTeam
Banned
From: Flamborough, Ontario
Registered: 2010-04-19
Posts: 2732

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

Well I'm a member of our local Historical board, & the one in the museum here says ice saw. There is plenty of info on the net that says so as well. Although I do notice the pic is actually called a hay saw in some links as well.

I think the jury is out on this one, & will go to a higher authority for the answer.


~Breeder of the finest Chariot Racing Chickens in Ontario. 2003-2004-2008-2009 Championship Winner~

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#17 2011-04-19 17:39:24

LittleChickenRacingTeam
Banned
From: Flamborough, Ontario
Registered: 2010-04-19
Posts: 2732

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

Ok I stand corrected...sort of

Here's a pic of a guy using 2 handed saw to cut ice blocks
http://www.tc.gov.yk.ca/digitization/images_web/007357.jpg

But then it looks like in this pic a guy is using the same kind of saw to cut hay
http://www.rhc.rdg.ac.uk/olib/images/FW/S/S136_4.jpg

And then this pic of the original type of saw/knife apparantly for cutting hay.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3080/3210396683_1c41fa7881.jpg

And to confuse the issue further, an antique ice saw in ad here that sure looks like the same hay saw.
http://www.proxibid.com/asp/LotDetail.a … id=8273633

I am more confused that ever.


~Breeder of the finest Chariot Racing Chickens in Ontario. 2003-2004-2008-2009 Championship Winner~

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#18 2011-04-19 17:42:26

Arcticsun
I Love A.C.E.
From: Wetaskiwin AB
Registered: 2009-02-02
Posts: 7074

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

I have a solution.
Both LCRT and Shadewolf are invited out to my place with the respective tools to try out on my over grown pasture. I will photograph thier progress and post it all on ACE.


Arcticsun Frickin Chicken ranch
A rainbow of colour in every egg basket!
Life is too short to to take ones self too seriously
Hug your chicken today

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#19 2011-04-19 17:57:29

HensHaven
A.C.E. Addicted
From: Caledon East, Ontario
Registered: 2009-11-27
Posts: 662

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

:goodpost: :iagree:


Wife, Mother of 3 grown boy, 2 great daughter-in-laws, 1 grandson, 1 granddaughter, Barred Rocks, black sex link, Rhode Island Reds,  Cochin,  Black Maren,  EE,  Welsumner Rooster, Polish rooster,1 Leghorn,  japenese, and many many more, 8 OEB chicks,  eggs always in the incubator,1 Black Russian Terriers, 1 Siamese tabby Lynx, 2 Lionheads and 2 mini Rex,1 New Zealand, and my toy poodle..

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#20 2011-04-19 23:18:43

Shadewolf
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From: Warburg, AB
Registered: 2010-01-14
Posts: 326
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

reneggaide roo wrote:

When I attended NAIT as a cabinetmaker we were trained in the principles of how cutting edges work.  The one with all the little teeth would be excellent at cutting ice or wood or some other dense material.  I have an old hay knife like shadewolf's and challenge anyone to come out here and show me how much ice they can cut with it.  There is a whole lake full of ice for us a couple miles down the road, Ill even give a chicken to the person who can actually cut a hole in the ice with a hay knife.    :veryfunny:

Rofl, with sheer determination I'll cut a hole in ice with it, but I bet I'll put my back out doing it!!! The knife is only sharp on the parts of the blade that are angled as opposed to the bottom of the blade. In any case I found out about the history of this particular design, and when and who it was patented by:

Before hay was baled it was harvested long and placed in hay stacks, or it was lifted up into barn lofts with slings or forks.  When this loose hay settled it was very difficult to remove from the stack.  The hay knife was used to cut off small portions of hay that could then be feed to the cows.  The knife had two handles, both on the same side, so that one could work close to the face of the stack without hitting their hands.  The design for this style of hay knife was patented by George Weymouth of Dresden, Maine on March 7, 1871.  The patent was reissued in 1882 and 1886 and both of those patents were assigned to Hiram Holt.  His company, The Hiram Holt Company of East Wilton, Maine, sold them using the name of the Lightning Hay Knife.  The cost for a Lightning Hay Knife was 50 cents in the 1897 Sears and Roebuck catalog.

I'd be thinking if anyone uses this design as an ice knife, that would likely be a regional or possibly local tradition as opposed to the original designed use. Considering that I'm an avid historian-type person, I'm interested to pursue the whole idea of how these hay knives came to be used as ice knives if they are also used as such and how widespread that usage is.


-- TechCowboys Farm, Warburg AB --
http://www.techcowboysfarm.com (our farm blog)
--- Farm Fresh Eggs, Roasted Coffee, Rabbits & Computer Repair ---
Alberta Rabbit Producers' Association member

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#21 2011-04-19 23:35:14

Shadewolf
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From: Warburg, AB
Registered: 2010-01-14
Posts: 326
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

Picture # 2 and picture #1 are different saws, or at least different handles it seems. Look closely at the 2nd picture and you will notice the part of the tool between the handle and the blade is straight and not S-curved.

LittleChickenRacingTeam wrote:

Ok I stand corrected...sort of

Here's a pic of a guy using 2 handed saw to cut ice blocks
http://www.tc.gov.yk.ca/digitization/im … 007357.jpg

But then it looks like in this pic a guy is using the same kind of saw to cut hay
http://www.rhc.rdg.ac.uk/olib/images/FW/S/S136_4.jpg

I am more confused that ever.

Lol I'm not confused! I think these pics definitely show farmers' general propensity for being handy to get the job done with whatever tools are close at hand. I find it funny that my desire to cut up my hay bales and brought us here, began with this train of thought:

"I think it would be easier to handle these big bales by cutting them...
...an axe isn't going to work well,...
...I wish I had dad's wood saw, but that's 1000+km's away in his garage...
...my hacksaw won't work for this and I don't have the right blades for it...
...I have a small chainsaw...that'll have to do!....oh wait...it could set things on fire....
...I'll try it anyway, the whole yard is soaking wet....
...Wow this chainsaw is making a mess, the blade is too short and hay is getting under my safety goggles....
....a few days pass and I spy a hay saw at RenegaideRoo's place, hot dam that's what I need!!!.....then he mentions there is one for sale at the upcoming auction....
....I go there and win the bid for it....
...come home and look at old farming practices on the internet and laugh about the whole process going backwards from the modern tools and techniques to the traditional ones....
.....appreciate all the lost skills and tools our forefathers in farming used to use!...
...go outside and cut bales with so much ease that it made forking hay fun!.....
....thought 'very cool, I still like farming and doing it with all the older tools! I wonder what other old tools I can get/make to help me'...
...realised when I woke up this morning I way overdid things in the yard... OWIE!!!...
...took some advil and went to work! "


-- TechCowboys Farm, Warburg AB --
http://www.techcowboysfarm.com (our farm blog)
--- Farm Fresh Eggs, Roasted Coffee, Rabbits & Computer Repair ---
Alberta Rabbit Producers' Association member

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#22 2011-04-19 23:39:33

Shadewolf
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From: Warburg, AB
Registered: 2010-01-14
Posts: 326
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

Sweet! Can I bring my scythe too?

Arcticsun wrote:

I have a solution.
Both LCRT and Shadewolf are invited out to my place with the respective tools to try out on my over grown pasture. I will photograph thier progress and post it all on ACE.


-- TechCowboys Farm, Warburg AB --
http://www.techcowboysfarm.com (our farm blog)
--- Farm Fresh Eggs, Roasted Coffee, Rabbits & Computer Repair ---
Alberta Rabbit Producers' Association member

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#23 2011-04-19 23:41:27

Shadewolf
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From: Warburg, AB
Registered: 2010-01-14
Posts: 326
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

So my next question is: Since farmers have needed to cut hay for like a bazillion years, what is the oldest tool you can find for the purpose? I'm looking for a picture or at least a fairly descriptive reference with a location and date of origin associated with it.


-- TechCowboys Farm, Warburg AB --
http://www.techcowboysfarm.com (our farm blog)
--- Farm Fresh Eggs, Roasted Coffee, Rabbits & Computer Repair ---
Alberta Rabbit Producers' Association member

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#24 2011-04-20 00:12:32

Shadewolf
A.C.E. Addicted
From: Warburg, AB
Registered: 2010-01-14
Posts: 326
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

There is some interesting reading on the subject if you google "book of the farm" volume 4 by Henry Stephens from about 1890 documenting common usage during that time period (on google books).

there's another mention of a hay knife that looks more like a scythe here:
http://www.harvestofhistory.org/assets/object-images/main/hayknife1.jpg

There's some more info in this book: "Knight's American Mechanical Dictionary" by Edward Henry Knight, pg 1080 also viewable on googlebooks

Recently I've been watching a couple documentary series on farming in both the Victorian and Edwardian periods by 3 anthropologist historians in Britain. Absolutely fascinating stuff, and in some cases very momentarily jarring when they document a practice from way back then that I happen to be using on my farm today! Even at the antique auction I attended this weekend past had a few jarring anachronistic moments when the auctioneer would hold up something and ask the audience what it was, and no one knew but me, having just studied it perhaps hours or days before.


-- TechCowboys Farm, Warburg AB --
http://www.techcowboysfarm.com (our farm blog)
--- Farm Fresh Eggs, Roasted Coffee, Rabbits & Computer Repair ---
Alberta Rabbit Producers' Association member

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#25 2011-04-20 01:02:09

Tittan
Growing Member
From: Parkland County
Registered: 2010-09-19
Posts: 39

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

That is soo useful I could have definitely use that this winter when it was -40 .... could you send some dimensions so I can fab one up. It looks quite simple to make.   
Thank you

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#26 2011-04-20 01:14:27

allymeagan
I Love A.C.E.
From: NW ON
Registered: 2009-02-17
Posts: 1567

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

:thumbsup:  Very cool!

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#27 2011-04-20 01:22:18

Shadewolf
A.C.E. Addicted
From: Warburg, AB
Registered: 2010-01-14
Posts: 326
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

I will measure it when I go outside in a little while :-)

Tittan wrote:

That is soo useful I could have definitely use that this winter when it was -40 .... could you send some dimensions so I can fab one up. It looks quite simple to make.   
Thank you


-- TechCowboys Farm, Warburg AB --
http://www.techcowboysfarm.com (our farm blog)
--- Farm Fresh Eggs, Roasted Coffee, Rabbits & Computer Repair ---
Alberta Rabbit Producers' Association member

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#28 2011-04-20 01:23:48

Fluffyfoofoo
A.C.E. Addicted
From: Calgary
Registered: 2010-07-28
Posts: 1105
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

Shadewolf, those silhouette pics of you were so cool. You are like Zorro with the ice saw carving the V in the hay. This has been such a neat thread, really enjoyed everyone's comments. I haven't watched tv in what... two weeks??? Way too boring, ha.


"Man did not weave the web of life - he is merely a strand in it. Whatever he does to the web, he does to himself." Chief Seattle, 1854.

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#29 2011-04-20 01:29:28

Schipperkesue
Moderator
From: Carnwood, Alberta
Registered: 2010-04-08
Posts: 10766

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

Fluffyfoofoo wrote:

You are like Zorro with the ice saw carving the V in the hay.

Shadewolf is Vorro!  Or is that "V for Vendetta"?

Sue


Embrace your mistakes....they are life's most meaningful education.

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#30 2011-04-20 01:50:10

Fluffyfoofoo
A.C.E. Addicted
From: Calgary
Registered: 2010-07-28
Posts: 1105
Website

Re: Got my hands on a hay saw!!

Schipperkesue wrote:

Fluffyfoofoo wrote:

You are like Zorro with the ice saw carving the V in the hay.

Shadewolf is Vorro!  Or is that "V for Vendetta"?

Sue

CORRECTION, CORRECTION: I'm aghast, I MEANT to type hay saw. My apologies. Must not anger Vorro, er: Vorro Vendetta.


"Man did not weave the web of life - he is merely a strand in it. Whatever he does to the web, he does to himself." Chief Seattle, 1854.

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